Is Satanic Warmaster NS?

Phosphorous_RedeemerFri, 12/08/2011 - 02:01

The topic is about whether or not sw is ns, not whether they suck or nazis suck. So lets table the matter.

What would make sw ns? The song "I Dream of 8", and that sw supports other ns bands. Other than that, there's really not much else. They may have racist lyrics but that doesnt mean Nazi beliefs. People can be racist without being nazis. Although i dont think you can be nazi without being racist.

But Satanic tyrant werewolf (or whatever his name is) has clearly stated in several interviews Satanic Warmaster is not ns.

FarFarNorth on Fri, 12/08/2011 - 02:13

What's in the lyrics of "I Dream of 8" though? Can be something more vague and occult in meaning, perhaps? or does the content support the ns assuption?

Phosphorous_Redeemer on Fri, 12/08/2011 - 02:20

To me, its clearly ns. It doesnt outright say heil hitler, but anyone with a basic understanding of the third reich and common sense will be able to pick it up. But at the same time, its really the only song i can find with pro nazi lyrics by satanic warmaster.

http://www.metal-archives.com/albums/Satanic_Warmaster/Carelian_Satanist...

Bayernpirat

on Fri, 12/08/2011 - 22:50

At the Wolfszeit Festival they are forbidden.
www.wolfszeit-festival.de under "Aktion you can see a list of NS Metal bands, you will throw for it from the festival

Phosphorous_Redeemer on Thu, 18/08/2011 - 00:04

interesting

Terroristic-Ham... on Fri, 12/08/2011 - 23:12

They clearly are. Look at all the splits they have with ns bands.

SatanicSchizo on Sat, 13/08/2011 - 00:24

"They" first of all, Satanic Warmaster is one man. So if Venom did a split with an "NS" band, they're now consider an "NS" band? Yeah... Makes perfect sense.

Phosphorous_Redeemer on Sat, 13/08/2011 - 00:28

satanic warmaster is one man-run, but there are other musicians who play in the band. And working with ns bands may not define national socialism, but it can definitely support it.

Terroristic-Ham... on Sun, 14/08/2011 - 20:47

Like phosphorous said SW has had many session members

as far as venom then No I see your point. but it still is supporting ns so in that case I would question there motifs.

ShieldbitersValhalla on Fri, 12/08/2011 - 23:51

When talking about NS and racism, you really have to define "NS" and "racism", since not everyone's definition is the same. For some people, NS is loving your people, and not hating other people, as long as they are living in their natural country. For others, it's just about hating. There are similarly different views on racism. Also, as far I know, the lyrics in "My Dreams of 8" aren't really NS. While they seem to describe the Third Reich, if vaguely, as well as blood, supremacy, etc. they do not explicitly demonstrate NS. However, there is a Death's Head in the middle of the band logo.

Ultimately, I think Satanic Warmaster cannot be NS, because if the band is supposed to be Satanic, then the band cannot combine Satanism with National Socialism. The idea of "Satanic NS" is absurd and ridiculous.

Phosphorous_Redeemer on Sat, 13/08/2011 - 00:36

Alot of bands use the death's head, namely Marduk, as a reference to violence, not national socialism. But lyrics about blood supremacy, and the third reich in my opinion are blatantly ns.

The lines in the song im referring to are;
"the man against time, in scorn against decline"
"one state, one folk, one leader, a true revelation"
"My dream of your empire fills me with joy"

He is either reffering to Hitler, Jesus, or Sauron from Lord of The rings...

mayhempunk666 on Sat, 13/08/2011 - 00:50

Sauron ftw

ShieldbitersValhalla on Sun, 14/08/2011 - 01:08

Haha, yeah Sauron.

ShieldbitersValhalla on Sun, 14/08/2011 - 01:13

(P.S.: Since this post was only about whether or not SW is NS, I didn't intend to imply that I like or dislike the music itself)(Totally off topic but: I actually dig what little I've heard of SW)

Phosphorous_Redeemer on Thu, 18/08/2011 - 00:06

I dont mind sw at all, but im not going to waste my time on bands that support ideals im against. Which is what we are trying to decide.

Deathcore.Is.No... on Sat, 24/11/2012 - 00:58

"The idea of "Satanic NS" is absurd and ridiculous."

Have you heard of the Joy of Satan clergy?

ShieldbitersValhalla on Sun, 25/11/2012 - 02:24

I have not heard of it. I looked for what I could find; what I saw is people who replace Jesus with Satan, and say "We come to Satan willingly" and they have their "sins" or something like that. With testimonies like "My life was going horrible until I came to Satan", etc, etc, exactly like typical Christian testimonies. I didn't see much about Satanic Nazis, except for one article that showed like a screen shot of an e-mail that contained the words "National Socialism". And there's a few definitions on Urban Dictionary as well haha.

But we all know how accurate the internet can be. Can someone who knows what it is explain it to me?

SatanicSchizo on Sat, 13/08/2011 - 00:26

Satanic Warmaster is not a political band. Werwolf has stated several times his music is "Black Metal", he hates the term "NSBM". I think Lauri Pentilla (Satanic Warmaster) may have some National Socialist political views but that's his business not ours.

Terroristic-Ham... on Sun, 14/08/2011 - 20:54

well the forum is about making it our buisiness. so.....

but any way nsbm and black metal are the same! .

SatanicSchizo on Sun, 14/08/2011 - 21:26

No. The forum isn't making it our business, just because it's discussed doesn't make it our business. Lauri is just a guy like everyone else and his political beliefs should be irrelevant, it doesn't affect our lives in the least and he makes good music so who cares?

Terroristic-Ham... on Sun, 14/08/2011 - 22:32

Personally I really don't care about Lauri's beliefs either. However I still believe he is a Proud supporter of the NS movement and its ideas. SW still is one of the best IMO.

Phosphorous_Redeemer on Thu, 18/08/2011 - 00:08

Uh, we're going over Satanic Warmaster ideals, not Lauri's ideals. I didnt ask what his favorite soda was, nor did i ask his political views...

Terroristic-Ham... on Thu, 18/08/2011 - 02:32

You cannot separate him from SW and NS is a political view. So I do not know what you're getting mad over.

" The topic is about whether or not satanic warmaster is ns..."

Phosphorous_Redeemer on Thu, 18/08/2011 - 02:37

I'm not getting mad, just saying that the discussion isnt taking any part of the singers personal life, as satanic shcizo implied.

SatanicSchizo on Thu, 18/08/2011 - 06:58

Lauri Pentilla IS Satanic Warmaster haha. Does it really matter that much though? The musics good, the lyrics aren't all "Heil Hitler" so there should be no issues.

Terroristic-Ham... on Thu, 18/08/2011 - 07:28

agreed

Phosphorous_Redeemer on Fri, 19/08/2011 - 00:42

So then thus far the vote is mostly no, satanic warmaster is not ns

Terroristic-Ham... on Fri, 19/08/2011 - 05:15

not from me I say they are NS even if all there songs aren't directly related from what I can tell.

Phosphorous_Redeemer on Sat, 13/08/2011 - 00:44

I will also add that the bands carpathian forest and Immortal have songs with the following lyrics;

"Domestic Purebred, of the everlifted North Sky"
"Acknowledge the supreme aryan puirty, that runs in the blood of my veins"

But they are obviously not nsbm...

mayhempunk666 on Sat, 13/08/2011 - 00:59

I think that in the song My Dreams of 8, hes obviously referring to Hitler, but not is a fully racist sense. I believe that hes using Hitler as an example of a man who created a powerful empire by uniting his nation under one symbol, one belief, and one goal, and fought to fill his world with only who he deemed to be the elite portions of humanity. (see second verse)

this is just my opinion on the song, im not the guy who wrote it so i dont know the real message behind the lyrics but this is what i get out of the song

Bayernpirat

on Sun, 14/08/2011 - 22:35

NS = National Socialism or Natursekt -> lol

mayhempunk666 on Sun, 14/08/2011 - 22:58

what is Natursekt?

mayhempunk666 on Mon, 15/08/2011 - 23:35

thank you

Phosphorous_Redeemer on Thu, 18/08/2011 - 00:09

haha

lak89 on Sat, 24/11/2012 - 17:52

exactly

Deathcore.Is.No... on Mon, 15/08/2011 - 04:29

I own Carelian Satanist Madness, and in the lyrics there is a printed "blood stain" over the words "Jewish God" in the (if I'm not mistaken) title track. I also own Black Metal Kommando/Gas Chamber (Fuck yeah!) and the intro for Macht and Ehre has a crowd chanting "Seig Heil". HOWEVER, there is no lyrics for this song, though there are for others. In the song Blessed be the Grim Arts, no lyrics are included in the CSM booklet. These lyrics are speaking against the Turks and Jews. To me, it seems like all the labels Nazgul has been on with SW have censored him.

Phosphorous_Redeemer on Thu, 18/08/2011 - 00:11

I think that seig heil isnt the same as "heil hitler," and its fine to hate jews, if you actually have a reason, otherwise your a true poser

Deathcore.Is.No... on Thu, 18/08/2011 - 00:27

Seig Heil is just Hail Victory. But I totally agree, I hate people who hate jews for NO reason. That's annoying

Phosphorous_Redeemer on Thu, 18/08/2011 - 01:07

definitely. When i worked at my grandfather's newspaper, there was a jewish synogague across the hall, and there were always jews blocking the parking lot, the hall, littering, letting their kids run around. Almost all of the businesses were owned by jews, and they kept trying to make gambling legal so they could turn their stores into casinos. That is my interaction with jews.
But anyways, about satanic warmaster...

BlackMetalRights on Mon, 15/08/2011 - 22:42

Of course they are!

DeathRipper on Sat, 24/11/2012 - 02:29

Now adays, when someone says something like I hate jews, people think you hate Hebrews. Jews and Hebrews are different. Hebrew is an ethnic group. Jews are people who practice the religion of Judism. When SW has the lyrics, "Burning down the jewish creation", to me, he's saying destroying something religious. I think he's singing about waging war against religion, not a race of people. So, no, I don't think SW is ns.

Hárbarðr on Sat, 24/11/2012 - 04:26

I agree, attacking Judaism IS NOT a direct and irrefutable proof of Nazism, not at all. So, in that sense, SW would not be NS.

However, that is not the one and only "piece of evidence" that would suggest the presence of said ideology, so i think, taking all into consideration, there is a nontrivial chance the project/band actually is NS.

TThrasher on Sat, 24/11/2012 - 09:36

I always love to see how someones favorite band can turn into the thing they despise the most when they find out about the bands political views. Just listen to whatever you like and don't be such a politically correct douchebag. No offence intended.

Hárbarðr on Sun, 25/11/2012 - 02:31

TheSomberlain1995 on Sun, 25/11/2012 - 20:26

Bombenhagel on Sat, 24/11/2012 - 11:53

Fuck SW racist or nazi both kind of people are stupid

Deathcore.Is.No... on Thu, 29/11/2012 - 00:03

What's wrong with National Socialism? It got your country from being broke as absolute hell to the brink of world domination within a decade..

DevilzForce on Sat, 24/11/2012 - 20:13

it's NS, so is his project ''the true werewolf''...
lauri is SW, lauri has political views he references in his projects... NS is a political view so yes it is... you can try and contort the truth all you want, but it just is !
still good music though

Tico Tyrant on Sat, 24/11/2012 - 21:07

I would argue that the lyrical and musical extent of Satanic Warmaster or even bands like Graveland, despite what they may be, simply don't paint them as clear cut 'NS' bands.

Unfortunately, with regards to any band that attempts to discuss nationalism, pagan virtue, heathenism, or even anti judaism...most of the metal community ( I'm just roughly estimating), but I'd say %80 of the community ...will immediately label and brand them as radically hateful, overly nationalist or 'nazi'...and based on this, they will boycott the music entirely.

It is well known that Lauri and people like Rob Darken, or Roman Saekno of Drudkh, have side projects and socio-political views that are strictly nationalist and drift towards that end of the spectrum....none of which are directly 'reich worshipers', but rather express no fear in exploring that subject matter...it can get very confusing and hard to say one way or another though with Werwolf as he is just as much a satanist as he is a nationalist.

Still great music though!
I figure if people can't except nationalism, or some kind of political view to to appear in black metal/pagan metal, then they really shouldn't be open to the genre at all.

Tico Tyrant on Sat, 24/11/2012 - 21:07

Some of my favorite bands that have black metal elements, are also nationalist...I even enjoy Slavic metal, well...some of it...I don't always agree with the root ideology in the music behind some bands, but often I can see, via comparison with the historical aspect or current paradigm in the country at hand, where these musicians are coming from. It's really powerful stuff and shouldn't be considered a threat.

I don't like third reich crap though, I figure the true 'ns' label should just be changed to NSDAP metal, for shit like Waffen SS , Aryan Blood or Der Stürmer

mayhempunk666 on Sat, 24/11/2012 - 22:05

+1 to everything

DevilzForce on Mon, 26/11/2012 - 15:47

like i said, i don't mind that shit, the man makes good music, what i DO hate is the fans that keep up this facade that it is not racially influenced... just be honest...
SW makes good black metal no doubt about that, but people need to stop saying that bands are not NS when they clearly are.

Tico Tyrant on Tue, 27/11/2012 - 09:21

'what i DO hate is the fans that keep up this facade that it is not racially influenced... just be honest.."
I agree with your mentality here, my problem therin is that I don't agree it applies to Satanic Warmaster. I think it's debatable...if the question was, is Werwolf fond of/supportive of National Socialism, well then the answer would unequivocally be "yes".
One things for sure, people that complain about so called 'ns' bands, shouldn't be bothered by them and just ignore them....but no, we have the rise of antifa -_-

DevilzForce on Tue, 27/11/2012 - 21:15

i agree :P
if it quacks like a duck and flies like a duck,chances are it's a duck hahahaha
you listen to it or you don't, end of discussion... people get their panties in a bumch for all kinds of reasons, if you don't like it... move on

VoiceOfTheSoul on Sat, 24/11/2012 - 22:29

Oh darn, it seems that Satanic Warmaster may have NS views. Allow me to proceed to throw away all of their CD's and merch I own and just stop listening to them.

Inhuman on Sat, 24/11/2012 - 22:50

About two years ago, SW was announced for a festival in Mexico. About a month before the festival was going to be, it was announced that SW had cancelled the show because the guy didn't wanted to play for a mexican crowd because of his "ideals" hahaha

Deathcore.Is.No... on Thu, 29/11/2012 - 00:02

I saw a flyer for SW in Mexico, I was quite surprised that he would choose to play there. i guess this explains it.

TheSomberlain1995 on Sun, 25/11/2012 - 20:25

there's also a song called "Der Schwarze Orden" Der schwarze orden was the police of hitler also known as SA or later SS.
I think it is but it doesn't really matter to me

non-existent user on Wed, 28/11/2012 - 20:09

ehh. i'm not an expert, but i'm pretty sure the SA didnt evolve into the SS.

TheSomberlain1995 on Wed, 28/11/2012 - 20:13

yeah. you're right. lol
heard this on youtube hahahahaha

mayhempunk666 on Thu, 29/11/2012 - 00:52

this is a random aside, but who the hell dug this fucking thing up?

i hadnt seen it in over a year until last week when it popped up again

VoiceOfTheSoul on Thu, 29/11/2012 - 01:24

aghartha if I'm not mistaken.

mayhempunk666 on Thu, 29/11/2012 - 02:25

ah. Fucking zombie threads man haha. I wonder this everytime one of these pops up. Its funny because its always some shitty NS debate forum

Tico Tyrant on Thu, 29/11/2012 - 07:58

whenever something seems to come out of the shadows, it's never like " what's the most over rated thrash band (unless it's some whiny crap about metallica) " no, it's always some people who want to share their pseudo socio-political wisdom on why NS bands and national socialism are the worst things ever. For once, I'd like to see a thread questioning bands that talk about communism in their motive....though I'm not sure those exist.
haha, just a side rant there dude, fuck I'm wired tonight

mayhempunk666 on Thu, 29/11/2012 - 09:44

actually now that you mention it, Communist black metal does exist haha. It gets no where near the attention NSBM does though, obviously. I completely agree, but at least these things havent degenerated to the level of youtube yet. Although that abyss records one got a little heated if i remember correctly .

i'll pm you with those Red Black metal bands

VoodooChild on Thu, 29/11/2012 - 11:18

Red Black Metal? never heard of that... But it sounds really scary to me.

mayhempunk666 on Thu, 29/11/2012 - 11:29

it's really fucking weird. It gives off a really odd vibe

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Awz4XE7S49E

VoodooChild on Thu, 29/11/2012 - 12:15

thnx man. I must admit it has a fucking sick sound. Though I completely disagree with their views.

ShieldbitersValhalla on Fri, 30/11/2012 - 07:01

Yeah, I've no love for commies, but I've heard some good bands with such themes.
Мракобесие covers the Katyusha song:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87lUg1Yxc9c

And a French band, N.K.V.D., named after Soviet secret police is not a communist band, but has themes on various dictators, which has an interesting feel.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=reWMbQVPZpg

mayhempunk666 on Fri, 30/11/2012 - 07:10

N.K.V.D are great. ive always thought the recording quality was hollow as shit though haha

Count AntiTheist on Mon, 14/04/2014 - 08:55

I am in a black metal band myself two man band and I focus my lyrics on being a communist and an atheist.

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