TShirtSlayer

Young metalhead here, need advices for my first battle jacket

OmeletteDuFromage
Wed, 12/04/2017 - 20:16

Hi there fellow metalheads ! \m/
I'm new to the forum, I'm 17 years old and willing to make my very own, first battle jacket \m/

But as it's my first one and I'm young and stupid, I have a few questions.

I think I may keep the sleeves on it, because it may look a bit better, and the denim jacket was offered to me for my birthday so I am not willing to ruin it

1/ How many patches can fit/do I need on a battle jacket ?
I am not that tall and kinda skinny so it is S-sized.
I actually have 2 patches, and ordered 9 patches but I will only receive the package in a few weeks.
There's still a lot of patches I want, from a lot of different bands, but I'm afraid it won't fit. Plus it's expensive as shit

2/ The battle jacket is actually blue, but i think it will look better in black, as I mostly have black and white (or grey and red) patches, and I think denim jackets look better in black, but sleeveless denim vests look better in blue.
So I will dye it black, my parents have black dye (I don't know what the fuck it is called in english but it's the shit you put in boiling water)
Do I need to bleach the jacket first for it not to turn dark blue instead of black ?
And also, is there a risk it will end up ruined if I bleach it ? Will I need to dye it multiple times ? I do not care if it's not completely black, if it's a little grey-ish, it'll do

3/ Do you know a website where I can buy patches, with a large choice, if possible cheap or affordable, and ship them to France (and please without 150 dollars for the shipping)
I think I will buy a few patches from the TSS community but it will depend on the price and the shipping.

4/ I saw a few battle jackets with studded shoulders, I think studs and spikes look cool as fuck, but someone told me it looks retarded. What do you think ?
I mostly saw battle jackets without studs in this website, so I wonder what you guys think. I don't give a fuck about what non-metalheads think

5/ How much time does it take to sew on a patch ? I can't sew for shit, but my parents and my sister will teach me soon, I just wanna estimate how much time I'll spend on this shit


Minty

To try to help

1) The amount of patches depends totally on you! I've seen awesome simple jackets with less than 5 patches and there's The Beast's vest which has around or over 250 patches on it so it's whatever you like.

2) Not sure

3) There are a bunch of sites that sell boots and official patches for pretty cheap. Here are a few. http://melcdistro.bigcartel.com
http://www.unholypatches.kingeshop.com
http://votsproductions.bigcartel.com
http://bloodlikerain.bigcartel.com

4) This is another thing where if you like it go for it! But I have heard of some people having issues in venues but that might be more common here in the U.S.

5) I just learned how to sew a few months ago and now it only takes 10-15 minutes to sew a regular patch on. It'll be tough at first and you will probably suck but just like anything else you have to practice.

Hope that helps.

OmeletteDuFromage

Thanks a lot mate ! I'll look at those websites later, thanks for your advices ! I think I'll put studs on it, fuck it

metalmaciejmetal

For studs you can get a good price on amazon it will take some time because it will likely come from china. By more than you need. When a pack of 100 cost 5 bucks its not too bad. You'll have to replace the studs over time

Kvlt_ured_Gentleman

Denim jackets are hard to dye but bleaching it first will probably work, I can't be sure tho, my vest is blue. Also if you want cheap patches, learn some ways to make your own, you can't beat the price.

On the topic of studs, if you decide to get any, only put them on an area where they won't get in the way of/be damaged by normal use, for instance I only put studs on the upper back panel of mine. Also I would only recommend British cone studs but that's really just preference.

OmeletteDuFromage

Thanks for the advices mate, I don't think I'll try to make my own patches any soon, I don't even know how to sew so I'll probably suck at everything I try, let's start slowly by buying patches, maybe in one or two years I'll make my own who knows
I think I'll put studs on the shoulders and maybe on the upper back. I don't think they'll get off, as these areas won't be damaged easily.
For the stud type, I love the studs that are kinda in "two parts" (I have no idea how to describe how they look, English isn't my native language) I may post a picture later

Chainbreaker

1) Not that many actually. Figure out which bands you absolutely love as opposed to like and start with those. The band you love most should be on the backpatch. It depends if you want to cover the whole denim or just parts of it how many patches fit, but if you fill it up completely, make sure the jacket clings to the body, because patches stretch out the denim. Also make sure that the backpatch is small enough for a small jacket (otherwise it stretches out the backside).
2) Can't help you with this, never dyed anything.
3)
eBay (for example mextremista)
This site (Turkeyman for custom ones)
Riff's merchandise
Metal Börse
Speedy Mailorder
Overzone
Depressive Illusions
... (Do some searching on the web)
4) It's your jacket, do what YOU like!
5) About half an hour- an hour if you take into account that first you have to find the perfect place for it, than you have to spend some serious time pinning it in a correct way, don't do it half ass or you'll have to start over. Sew over the border and not next to the border as something may catch underneath it.

metalmaciejmetal

I ordered a sweet Bolt Thrower patch from Turkeyman, i'll see how it works out.

I tried depressive illusions, but their website is kind of shitty, I placed an order and I never ended up getting a paypal invoice to be able to send them the money. They have cool selection but I couldn't order from them.

Chainbreaker

I received my order from Depressive Illusions just fine. The patches are really small, but that's what I'm after and the embroidery is great! Cd's are shipped without their case to save on shipping. Sorry to hear you couldn't order from them.

metalmaciejmetal

Hm... im going to try this again maybe. II must have screwed something up. It didn't look like there was a email I could get any help

Nater90

For Depressive Illusion you need to PayPal them the amount of your order, it gives you a total and their email address, Done it and went fine.

OmeletteDuFromage

Thx mate

metalmaciejmetal

My first suggestion would be to start with big back patch if that's the style you want.

1. A lot of patches can fit if you try. My suggestion is order your patches. Once you have those 10 patches start laying them out on your jacket. You can just use clothing pins to hold the patches down temporarily.

2. Yeah dye is the correct word. If you want your jacket to be black try to use denim dye. https://www.amazon.de/Rit-Dye-Fl%C3%BCssigkeit-schwarz-Schwarz/dp/B00FRM... I used this dye on the vest im wearing in my picture. It was originally dark blue, it worked out ok but if you look closesly you'll notice it isn't truly black but at a metal show as if you can see the difference.

3. I recently placed an ordered from these guys http://shop-hellsheadbangers.com/metal_Patches_black_death_thrash_grind_... selection is great, price is decent about 4 to 5 euros each. I went with them because it was the only place I could find Kat and Master's Hammer. The shipping wasn't too bad either and im in Canada. So far so good. Now I just need to wait and see how they turn out.

4. Studs are up to you and your style. When I started my first jacket I was concerned if I do this or I do that is this ok on a metal jacket. I realized, it doesn't matter. Its up to you and how you want to express yourself. There are no rules. I have studs on this jacket https://tshirtslayer.com/battle-jacket/maciejs-battle-jacket you need to commit. Studs callus your hands like crazy, maybe use a tool to fold the studs in.

5. It takes time, especially if you've never done it. You'll get better as time goes by. It takes me maybe 5 minutes to sew on a small patch.

OmeletteDuFromage

I don't know what band backpatch to choose, I love a lot of bands and I didn't find (and didn't look much tbh) a proper Sepultura or Pantera backpatch that doesn't cost an eye, and with a design I like
+ Nice jacket by the way, I like pyramid studs, nice patches too

Did you bleach the jacket before dyeing it ? Or did you dye it without bleaching it ? Is there a risk to ruin it if you bleach it ? Or do I have nothing to loose trying ?

metalmaciejmetal

I didnt bleach it at all. It was just a dark blue jacket, i dunked it in a bucket of Rit denim dye (the stuff i linked to) then i left it outside to dry. Im not sure what bleach is supposed to do to help the dye process. I would just follow the instructions on the package. Let it soak for an hour or so longer than the instructions state. Also be careful when you pull it out of the bucket. I used wire coat hangers to not get my hands dirty

Thanks man, i worked hard at it. Yours will look sick too if you keep adding to it over time

OmeletteDuFromage

By what I read, if you dye black a blue vest, it will end up (very) dark blue, not totally black.
Some people wrote it's better to bleach it first to remove the blue so there will only be the black color, and it may look better.
But I'm not sure if it's worth the time and the efforts

metalmaciejmetal

That actually makes a lot of sense. Bleach will get rid of the blue making it easier to become a pure black. What i learned is add extra dye for the black to really sink in

Corvus Corax

Using a coin can help with bending the prongs for studs.

Metaldemon

Do yourself a favor and make sure the patches you put on correspond with records you listen too and that you make yourself very familiar with that group. Your a youngster and you have a lot of time to listen to many genres. Don't be in a freggin rush!! And plan out VERY CAREFULLY your back patch make sure its a group or album that inspired you or you really like. Back in my day your back patch says it all about you or the group you hung around. DO NOT just put patches on just because there freakin kool!!! Enjoy young man and Stay metal!!!

OmeletteDuFromage

Haha thanks man, I know that, I really choose carefully my patches and try to know more the bands before I buy patches from them (that's why my jacket will mainly have mainstream band patches on it, that's the bands I listen to since I was born)
Yeah don't worry, I grew up and spent my whole life listening to metal, and I don't wanna look stupid when people ask me if I know the band on my jacket !
The backpatch tho, is the only problem, I'm still pretty confused.
I don't know what backpatch to chose, backpatches are expensive, hard to find and the design has to please me + to correspond to my music tastes. I think I'll go for a Sepultura backpatch, as I already have a nice Pantera patch.

Metaldemon

Take your time. I'm an old teenager from the 80s. So we all where careful when it came to the back patch. One more thing make sure you TRY to buy licensed patches. Bootlegs are all right but usually the original stuff looks better and you are supporting the band too. Pantera and Sepultura are all good bands and I remember when they first started. Pantera has some pretty kool Artwork. Visit my page for old-school jacket artwork is a big factor too!! Have fun!! Oh yes one more thing whipstitch or lock stitch and glue (optional) your patches it preserves the edges and they won't tear off, I used to use embroidery thread from my Grannys sewing kit or tent and awning thread. Don't go cheapy on the thread little brother!!!

metalmaciejmetal

Some good points. Do you think that the thread make that huge of a difference? Ive had a back patch tear off in a moshpit so what i ended up doing is sewing it on with a machine. No way its coming off now. Its not so much the thread as the technique. Its like bicycle spokes, the smaller the gap the strong the stitch

Metaldemon

Double thread on embroidery thread or awning thread with a whip stitch those fuckers aren't coming off. Go look at my jacket on my page those bastards been on that jacket for over 32 years and have seen some shit! There's the proof.

Fukkunt

which Glue do you recommend for denim?

metalmaciejmetal

If you can find a good quality printer Arise back patch that would look sick. The new album album has a cool cover too kind of taking influence from arise

OmeletteDuFromage

Yeah, I'm really not a fan of the new Sepultura band lineup, I don't like anything (or almost) they did after the Cavalera bros left, but I really think Machine Messiah is a very good album with a nice artwork.
Arise isn't my favorite Sepultura album, but the artwork looks fucking cool and the album has some killer tracks in it so I don't know.
If I can find a good quality Roots backpatch, it would be sick : it may be my favorite album from them (it's the album that got me into Sepultura, the first I listened to)

Metaldemon

Oh yeah one more thing about spikes. I don't know about France but some concerts around here in the U.S. won't let you in a concert venue with spikes on. Studs only! For obvious reasons.

OmeletteDuFromage

As english isn't my native language, I don't understand at all the difference between the two.
Could you post an image comparing the two so I can understand ?

Lizard

Studs are the flat ones that are not dangerous. Spikes are the long ones which you could pierce other people's faces with.

Metaldemon

1986 I went to the Slayer concert for my 16th birthday and actually seen a guy get his eye gouged out by another guy in the Mosh pit who was wearing 3" spikes on his shoulders it was pretty nasty!

Nater90

Hahahaha, Lizard you're a fucking legend, Day = made.

But yeah be sure to see what the rules are like, I used loctite on my spikes you'd need a drill to break the grip.

OmeletteDuFromage

Hahaha thanks Lizard for the good laugh
I understand a bit more now

kaspersoldal

Spikes can do nasty stuff. On the plus side you can turn your jacket into a knuckle duster if you get some thick patches and put spikes on it.

Ravishing Grimness

Takes some practice to sew the patches on.Ask your mom to help out with a sewingmachine,goes ten time faster.

OmeletteDuFromage

We don't have a sewing machine at home anymore, I could ask my grandma to help me with her sewing machine.

Metaldemon

Eehh!...... Hand sew!! Bleed alittle!!! Lol!! Its a right of passage. We all did that

Fukkunt

if you must dye your jacket then look into Procion dyes...the shit like rit or dylon is not going to make it black!

best to find a black jacket

OmeletteDuFromage

Fuck...
Must I bleach it ?
Where do I find the shit you're talking about ? English isn't my native language, I don't know what the fuck you're talkin about

Metaldemon

Find a black Levis jacket don't dye it. You'll regret it. To bad you don't live here in the U.S. I have a medium black levi jacket I could've givin you.

OmeletteDuFromage

Hahaha I really want a black jacket, wait for me I'll take the next plane to the US
I just hope they don't drag me outta the plane and beat me up because they overbooked (lol)

Metaldemon

Ha Ha Ha!! Yeah America is a different place! Man I'd love to give this jacket to you man. But I don't trust customs anymore.

Fukkunt

Procion is a type of dye not a brand. google it...

the best option is to buy a black jacket or just use your blue one.

dont bleach the jacket it will ruin it

Metaldemon

If your talking about a denim jacket and bleaching it? All your gonna do is weakin the threading.

Fukkunt

yeah but im sure it doesnt help if youre going to dye it...doesnt take the dye too well. i could be wrong but its not me experimenting

OmeletteDuFromage

So basically I shouldn't bleach it ?
I don't know who to trust anymore, everyone is sayin' something different, I don't even know if I should or shouldn't dye it...

What's sure is that I want a black jacket. The jacket I have for the moment is really nice and fits me well, but it is blue.
I won't do my battle jacket with a blue jacket, so I don't know what could possibly go wrong with me trying to dye it.
Even if I fuck up trying, who cares, I wouldn't have wore it blue anyway ?

I'll just have to find a black jacket, and that's the hard part, I can't find a good quality one, that doesn't cost 60 bucks.

Fukkunt

i have been told that if you use Bleach the fabric will not dye as good as without dye....

If you dont mind the jacket to look darker but not fully black then you can just use cheap dye like RIT.

If you dont like the blue colour just dye with any black dye you can find.

kaspersoldal

1. Depends on what you want. I remember seeing a jacket with two complete layers of patches at one of my first concerts and it somehow managed to look amazing. Some jackets look perfect with only a single patch but it's really just up to your taste. The jacket should be you after all.
2. I honestly have no idea but the afaik it's best to keep the amount of chemical treatments at a bare minimum.
3. Festivals are your best friends for patches. Otherwise ebay should be good. Sometimes concerts will let you get patches that aren't sold other places but it might just be my preference for touching the patch before I buy it. Never bought from here (albeit planning on it) but it seems to me like TSS is good even though it has its scammers.
4. Stud the shoulders if you want. I tried to stick with my own jacket's vanilla placement and I think the spikes worked out pretty well. Just don't go overboard. Denim can only hold a limited weight and it'd suck to have your jacket tear because you went overboard with studs in every possible place.
5. It shouldn't take long but it's best if you just dedicate a day in the weekend to sewing on the patches. That way you'll have plenty of time to make some last second adjustments or fix any problems you first notice after you're done.

OmeletteDuFromage

Thanks a lot, every answer is appreciated and helps me making my mind for the different choices / decisions I'll have to take during the process !
I'll let you all guys know how it's going ! \m/

OmeletteDuFromage

UPDATE #1
Thanks a lot guys, your answers helped me a lot, further help is appreciated ! \m/

I received the patches I ordered, I only had two patches, a Slipknot and a Pantera one (the shaped logo of Slipknot, and the Vulgar Display Of Power album cover)
Now, I also have : Metallica, Iron Maiden, Eluveitie, Ghost, Motorhead, Marilyn Manson, Death, Slayer.

Tho two patches are defective (like, they have an error on the printing process so they look shitty), so I'm looking forward exchanging them for actual normal patches from the website I ordered them.

I now need patches/backpatch from the bands : Black Sabbath, Sepultura, Sex Pistols, The Exploited, Ensiferum, Rage Against The Machine, Korn, and if possible Misfits and Rob Zombie.
I found most of them, I'm looking for the rest.

About the five questions I asked, I can now tell what I'll do, you can correct or help me if you think that's not the right thing to do :
1/ I'll order patches from all the bands I love, and then I'll see if it fits. If it doesn't, fuck it, I'll have to send back some of the patches I bought, or to find a solution. Let's do it the metal way dammit
2/ I'LL DYE IT BLACK, tho without bleaching it as you guys are saying it is more likely to damage the denim. Let's just pray the color doesn't look like shit afterwards.
3/ I think I found my happiness on various website, I checked some of the website you guys gave me, thanks a lot
4/ Fuck it, studs and spikes are cool. I'll put them on the shoulders.
5/ It'll take the time it'll take.

I found three back patches on the internet :
A Black Sabbath one (78 tour), a Sepultura one (Machine Messiah album cover), and a The Exploited one.
I don't know which one to chose.

- Black Sabbath may be one of my favorite metal bands, I fucking love a lot of their songs, their riffs, the fact that they are precursors of heavy metal, the fact that Ozzy is fucking cool, the fact that Dio sang for them, and the patch looks sick.

- Sepultura is, for sure, one of, if not my favorite metal band. Max Cavalera, and his brother, are total bad asses, and I love Soulfly and Cavalera Conspiracy. I love Sepultura, thrash and death metal are two of my favorite metal subgenres. Now, the Machine Messiah album, despite the fact it was made by the new Sepultura lineup, is fucking cool. I also like the artwork, so the patch is really nice. Now, not only my jacket will be mostly black and white, with a bit of red, so, an almost entierly blue backpatch could ruin the spirit of my jacket. But also, if people see me with this backpatch, they will be lead to think I'm a fan of the new Sepultura lineup, which is completely false. Machine Messiah is, imho, the best, and only good album the new Sepultura lineup ever did. And I'm a die-hard Cavalera fan.

- The Exploited is one of my favorite punk bands, and I'm almost as much a punk as a metalhead. Plus the artwork looks fucking cool, and it's completely black and white, which is the two colors I want to be the most seen on my jacket. So it'll fit.

What do you guys think ?

metalmaciejmetal

I check my old patches i have a White Zombie and a Misfits patch from when i went to high school but they are in rough shape. I have a children of bodom and a dimmu borgir i can give you those if you want. Ill post it later.

OmeletteDuFromage

Haha nice ! I like White Zombie, but prefer Rob Zombie. I also like Misfits, very good band.
Children Of Bodom is a good band even if not my cup of tea, I really don't know Dimmu Borgir tho. (I'm not really a black metal fan, I'm much more a Death/Thrash/Punk/Folk/Nu/Industrial Metal fan)
I'd like to see what your patches look like, you're really cool (plus you're helping me a lot with all your replies on this thread, thanks a lot man)

metalmaciejmetal

I posted them on my page. Let me know if you want them, I have no issue mailing it to you. The misfits one just looks really bad, not really worth it.

Metaldemon

Sounds good!! I like the fact your doing a jacket from my time period 1981-1992 and your honoring a lot of the pioneering bands being an old guy I can appreciate it. As far as glueing your patches I used to use whatever, rubber cement, elmers, model glue, etc. Etc. Have fun my young little Metal brother!!

OmeletteDuFromage

Thanks a lot !
Yeah, nearly all of the music I listen to is from the 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s (from rock and protopunk to death metal, industrial metal and crust punk)
Honoring the pioneering bands of these genres is one of my objectives, as they're the bands I grew up with (because my father was a metalhead back then, he's almost your age ! 45 years old this year - so he raised me with this music) !

Metaldemon

I like it!!! I'm 48 so yeah your dad and me chewed the same dirt!!!

R21

https://tshirtslayer.com/patch/need-money-beer-and-gigs

If you want anything let me know, some cheap some expensive :)

OmeletteDuFromage

Thanks a lot ! I'll see if I need anything you have, I'll let you know

Der Todesking

One advice from me would be to not hurry anything, only buy patches that are really special to you (like from your favorite albums or bought at gigs). A good Kutte is a work of years. And just do what you really like & you can stand behind.

Metaldemon

I said the same thing too. Very good advice don't rush!! At least you guys have the Internet I had to physically walk my ass to the music stores and mail order back in the day. Lol!!!

kaspersoldal

Nice to not be the youngest person I know of here anymore. Hoping so see the jacket soon!

Suff Sleazy

Best places to buy patches in my opinion are some facebook groups like Original & Bootleg Metal Patches and Battlejacket Gallery and Patch Trading Post. Also http://www.unholypatches.kingeshop.com/Patches-bbbaaaaaa.asp , https://www.riffsmerchandise.com/c-3116764/metal-shop/ and naturally ebay. And there are people like UKR Patcher who can make custom patches of any bands that you want.

Also I'd advice to get as many woven patches as you can and avoid the printed patches since woven onces always look so much better :)

Use a lot of time to come up with a good layout since it's the most important thing and will seperate the good vests from the bad ones.
If I was doing a vest I would avoid it being too "squared up" so get some shapes in there.

metalmaciejmetal

I would agree with riffmerchandise. I just got my order. Some cool stuff. Some rare stuff I've never seen before. Some patches are a bit shoddy but I think those are not official.

streetcrust

1) fit as much bands as you like. Some people see lots of bands live/fans of lots of bands so you see alot of fully patched jackets, some only really love 1-10 bands ( me included) Only put patches of bands/albums you like though. No point putting a band patch on your jacket if you feel "iffy" about them

2) Bleaching is needed to dye clothing usually .The indigo ( the dye that makes denim blue ) in denim is usually treated with a stabilizing chemical that is used to preserve dye. Although i wouldn't call it ruining, the denim might turn into a cream color/orange tinge, personally i would just keep it blue ( my preference )

3) personally i use http://www.metaldevastation.com/ ( These guys are in the USA and im in canada ) Try to use your local ebay if you dont want to spend stupid ammounts on shipping... But if you really like a band and you want merch/music sometimes you have to spend the money, remember that getting into metal and buying shit is a hobbies. You will spend dumb amounts of money sometimes if you really want something ( ask anyone on this site)

4) Do what you want. Studs are cool for some, Dumb for others. Personally after studding countless number of vest i have come to this conclusion "If you stud, you lose space for patches" Also remember that sudding takes time and takes some experience to not look like "Im edgy, i listen to metal"

5) i use dental floss. Take dental floss, put it through the neddle, burn both lose sides together and start sewing ( Put sewing needle inside the patch- out) After patch is sewn on cut remainder floss and pull it till the floss is tight, burn floss into fabric and press melted floss bubble flat. a basic patch takes me from 5-10 mins if im really rushing. A back patch can take me 10 mins-few hours if i lose focus and start googling shit.

Corvus Corax

I would disagree, regarding the use of bleach. Bleach damages the fibers and will compromise the integrity of your item. That being said, they do have colour removers out-there that are used for removing dyes. This will remove the colour and, you are free to dye your jacket, as you see fit.

Another point of interest; if you're wanting to achieve a 'true-black', use bottle black (or two depending on the weight of the item. I always follow the recommend amount, as put-forth by the brand of dye) and a half-bottle of brown or dark brown.

The over-all rule; have fun. Enjoy the process. Depending on who you are, it can be addictive and obsessive at times, frustrating at others.

Good luck mate!

Distanz666

Haven't read all comments but if you're from France check out the eBay store PATCH NOIR they have a lot of stuff and the shipping should go fast and should be inexpensive since they're from the same country
Good Luck!

OmeletteDuFromage

Hi there ! I'm back after a week of holidays without internet
My father knew he had some old patches somewhere, because he had a battle jacket when he was younger ; so we looked for the patches in his old stuff, and we found two vintage patches (from the 80s or 90s, don't know), a Ramones one and a Sex Pistols one !
Sadly, we were looking for a the exploited one, but we didn't find it.

I actually have 13 patches, I just need to find the perfect backpatch (don't know if I'll take a The Exploited or Black Sabbath back patch), and to color the vest.

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Recent Comments

  • Yeah, total boot.
  • Cool
  • Thanks \m/
  • Je vais y jeter un œil. Merci!
  • Thanks! I had more coloured patches on the previous ones; but today I'm ok with mostly b/w patches.
  • Merci! L'album de Goatvermin ne m'a pas emballé. Les démos sont tellement sauvages...
  • Fucking awesome, thanks mate lml
  • Thanks Nater mate..yeah Corpse Molestation a must..3 patches is a start man cant wait to see yours when done..only got c
  • http://vintage-t-shirt-museum.blogspot.de/2015/01/iron-maiden-flight-of-icarus-world.html so this is a bootleg i guess?
  • One of a bunch of great shirts I picked up from Nicola Visintini :)
  • Killer \m/
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