TShirtSlayer

What the fuck is an Metal Eletist??????

Metaldemon
Mon, 13/03/2017 - 07:13

Me and my 26 year old nephew went to a concert and his buddies called him an elitist and some other girls where arguing about being an elitist and then everybody turns to me the 48year old headbanger about my opinion and I just stared at these young fucks and said "I don't know" so could somebody tell me what the hell is an Metal eletists? No such thing in the mid 80s. Obviously something fuckin new again.


parregeaboppe

Mabey your nephew was wearing some nsbm related?

Metaldemon

Ehhh! He was wearing a sponge bob square pants hoodie and black sabbath hat. NO He's not retarded!!!

grime81

ha! they must not have heard this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NQgLfQWmE4

Metaldemon

HA HA HA fuckin eh!! Nice grime81!!! Ill recommend that tune highly my Brotha!!!

Iron Animal

a metal elitist is someone that just listens to, lets say 80`s metal, and thinks every other metal gerne is bullshit, and every one that listens to something i dont like is a poser.

for example if someone comes to me with an amon amarth shirt, without even knowing him, i dont like him just because he listens to them. some would say that makes me an elitist.

SmirG3l

[Quote]

A person who believes their metal music is superior to other people's music. These people only listen to metal music and categorize metal through sub-genres. Some metal elitists are so wound up, that they tend to only listen to one type of metal sub-genre. Metal Elitists are usually found listening to underground metal bands and cut down other people's musical taste if it is not up to par with their own.
"Dude that guy was an asshole. He completely cut down my music and told me that I was wrong for listening to the music that I do, saying it wasn't

"real" metal and then he went on to call me a hot topic mallcore." - Person A

"Yeah dude, that's a Metal Elitist for ya" - Person B
[end quote]

useless bullshit.

Metaldemon

That is B U L L S H I T !!!! Highest level of bullshit!! We just listened to anything destructive and that's how our little group rolled back in the day. Lol!!!

ajnin

IMO its just someone who thinks they are more metal than the next guy.

this sums it up I think - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y24MmylTeY4

Suff Sleazy

Haha, I love this topic. I see metal elitism all the time in comments on youtube and such, never actually ran into one in real life yet. I think there's a little bit of metal elitism in all of us, but some of us know how to contain our opinions xD
Here's a really funny video about Metal Elitist. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgmE6W7iRxQ&t=43s

grime81

HAHA! i think your right! deep down everyone wants to "stick to their guns" so to say
i like to see humor in it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NQgLfQWmE4

xasthur1349

Both these songs are fuckin' hilarious

Thrashattck94

Metal elitist: an arrogant spunkpuppet who is opposed to the concept of anything other than the genre they love.

Daniel Sodomaniac

Kids of today, "19 get alot of money from mommy buy Heavy Load shirt from Ebay for 170 € then run around acting metal monster".

Metaldemon

Lol!!!

Stathis

rofl

Metaldemon

Yeah I think his little group of idiots where fuckin taken back when I told them I thought they were all takin about a Golf club HA HA HA HA!!! Fuckin a 9 iron metal eletist!!!# Lol!!.......Hey guys Thanks for explaining the shit. Does sound freggin stupid! Just listen to what you want and tell the others to go fuck a donkey!!!

Nater90

Couple of my mates and girlfriend call me a Metal Elitist because I listen to so many different genres of Metal and I correct people if they're wrong.

When I did my radio show one of my mates played Aborted so I asked if he liked them because I've seen them before, He said that he did and their a pretty awesome Deathcore band, I corrected him saying their Death Metal and ripped him a new asshole.

Metaldemon

Some of the same shit back in the 80s when we would correct somebody who didn't know the difference between glam crap and heavy/thrash in that instance we would just kick the shit out of the little poser. problem solved!!

Nater90

I'd rather someone be open and say they enjoy some songs or a band, Even if their not 100% of the sub-genre it appears to be because there is fucking heaps! At least be able to back up why you like / dislike it, Not just say "Because I do / don't".

Just research and learn something, I post on a gaming forum, A few of us got together and made a Metal topic, We gave each other stuff to check out that we were enjoying and through that I researched the bands, genres and found some wicked as fuck stuff, Hell I bought couple Cannibal Corpse patches from a mate and got an Autopsy one with them, Didn't know boo from a goose and people on here said their wicked & check em out, I did, And now think their fucking epic.

Just be able to agree or disagree and provide a reason why is all I ever ask of anyone.

Metaldemon

Very logical and I agree Nater90. My experience is vastly different from the late 70s early/ mid 80s there were no elitist but a shit load of poser / wannabe fuckers and crap like that. It was kind of a cluster fuck back then with MTV too.! but you knew your place. Its interesting how shit from back then has evolved into today's Metalhead way of life so to speak. I'm actually learning all over again. But this Elitists shit gotta go!. From what everybody is posting its sounds like a bunch of know it all asshole wannabes all over again. But like you said give me a reason why you like or dislike and give an explanation. This is why metalheads like our selves have and always will be real people not fake put a smile on face and throw a fuckin metal shirt on and call it good we can see right thru those bitches. Keep it real!!!

Nater90

Thanks very much.

Posers are always going to happen, Soon as something is Media Friendly and accepted, People jump on it like moths to a flame. Comes with anything not only music.

I would imagine from what I've discussed with experienced metal heads (my polite way of saying older folk because I'm envious of your past and epic experiences) it was more relaxed with the people that got on / had a common interest!

You never stop learning each and everyday you'll learn something you weren't aware of!

I agree, Can tell you the fans are compared to the posers, Just stay true and enjoy it for yourself I say.

Cheers, Take it easy.

NocturnalOccultist

Elitists are like thrid-wave feminists/antifa/sjw's of metal

Ironhead

Elitism is an inevitable part of any subculture, be it football fanaticism or metal music or whatever. Anyone claiming to never have any "elitistic" thoughts, whether he/she expresses them to others or not, is just full of bullshit. When you're young and new to metal, many older people act like elitists towards you, wait a decade (unless they were right for not taking you seriously and you have already given up being a metalhead) and you find yourself in their position. I don't get why people have to make such a big problem out of it nowadays, is everyone so damn fragile that they can't take a bit of natural pack animal behaviour (which elitism is) without crying about it on the internet?

metalmaciejmetal

I keep replying to the wrong posts

T.N.B.M. Cymbalvoldtektsmann

Elitists are the ones stopping the underground from becoming infested with hipster atheism and political correctness, imho.
Hail Metal Elitism, especially in Black Metal!

xasthur1349

+1

Goathammer

The only one speaking sense thus far.

satan's radish

"Hipster atheism". New to me. I don't even know what that's supposed to be in relation to, you know, "regular" atheism. Am I supposed to interpret it literally as "atheist hipsters", or as some metaphor cooked up by the ANUS set to describe the "ironic" hipster state of mind? Or is it just some new op-ed piece buzzword we're parroting now? For what it's worth, pretentious ANUS nerds and people who quote op-ed pieces like they're George Carlin jokes aren't any better than shallow, empty "hipsters". Just different flavors of pathetic, unjustifiably smug retard.

Cannubis

What the hell is the "ANUS set?"

andermatten

hahaha

xasthur1349

Relevant videos:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgmE6W7iRxQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OI2SkSTzXDM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FP7K-bqPnWQ

First of all, I don't identify as an elitist. I hate the term when it is applied to fans of music. Listening to a particular genre of music doesn't make anyone special (at least anymore, where even the most obscure stuff is readily available at the click of a few buttons. I think that in the past, this may have had more meaning, as the fandom of certain bands could be kept "under control" and obscure bands could retain a cult following, but nowadays anyone Tom, Dick, or Harry with a mouse and half a brain could click on a Youtube video and discover in a few seconds what might have taken some serious tape trading to discover). This is especially the case when fans claim to be "elitist" and special but do nothing but listen to metal at the cost of self care, personal development, etc...

I DO think that the term elitism can be applied to musicians, people who are creating top quality, cult fucking music, and their output. Ex. [Insert True Black Metal Band here] can be Elitist, but basement dwelling fan who lives off their parents and does nothing else with their life, cannot.

While I disagree with the use of the term "elitist" for fans, I do think that sometimes, the function performed by said elitists can be beneficial to pruning a genre, and keeping it true to its cult roots. Ex. I do not consider [Insert relevant Blackgaze, Post-Black Band here (I of course, take certain exceptions here... There are a few bands which retain the spirit of the genre, but present the music in this format which I like)] to be Black Metal. The elitists, help to cast a negative light on said band, which keeps out bands distilling and watering down the initial core idea of a genre.

Note: I'm not sure if I personally would apply this term outside of the Black, Black Ambient, Dark Ambient, Dungeon Synth, Black / Death, Bestial, War ... (Black Metal and most associated cult subgenres), but your opinions may differ.

Metaldemon

Ok so are you saying an elitist is somebody who is a band critic ? Who stays within the metal genre?. Cause if that's the case we could've used a few of those people back in the day to filter out the Glam-shit.

Goathammer

Elitism from fans and bands is necessary especially in Black metal, it keeps the tourists at bay, and lets those "Tom, Dick or Harry" types know where they stand. Black metal is more than just the music it's an entire sub-culture separate from the metal community at large. Really I believe people use the term elitist in a derogatory sense simply because they don't have the same passion and it's irksome to them to think someone might have a deeper devotion. In all honesty whenever someone throws that word my way I view it as a badge of honour. But I must add here that anyone who wishes to put in the time and effort will eventually be viewed through the same lense by those fans who are more casual. These days even correcting someone on a country of origin or a release date is considered an elitist action.

Metaldemon

Ok ......so there is a need for somekind of elitism aspect of our culture? So people my generation from back in the day, how do you catagorize us? Not elitist? Having my nephews friends look at me that night like wanting my approval or some kind of OK. Do they think of me as some kind of grandpa metalhead?? Its weird. There's about 30+ years in differences.

Goathammer

I would think of you as just another metal head, your age in relevance to mine means nothing. And anyone worth their salt wouldn't look to an older metal head to pat them on the head and tell them it's OK, that's some serious bullshit.

What I am getting at is that I personally identify with the extreme side of metal, particularly Black metal. I've invested more than half my life at this point researching, learning and consuming everything related to Black metal. So when you take someone with limited knowledge of a genre and they act like they know everything even though they've nary been around the block, it angers me. For someone to think that they can just jump in and forgo all the work and time spent just because they don't care enough about it, and instead just want to maintain the appearance of a real BM fan. But the truth is that most true metal fans can smell casuals/posers from a mile away, and regardless of the genre they don't fucking approve of it.

Metaldemon

Fucking 2 thumbs up Goathammer!!! At least now I don't feel like a old ass geezer, and I don't want to be an Elitist, I like your answer brada!! Rotting Christ was the first 1987 -88 Greece? There a little hard to understand. You could put Venom in that category too. Black metal is very kool that's as much knowledge I have pertaining to blackmetal.

Ironhead

Let's say one of those glam trendies would've suddenly pulled on a Slayer shirt just to be able to join you and your friends acting like he's one of you because of that shirt. You and your friends would've probably just told him to fuck off, right? He would have then gone to cry on the internet how you guys are elitists, only that internet didn't exist. That's the elitism in metal community that people nowadays feel so offended by easily summed up. And it's pretty natural and alright in my eyes.

Metaldemon

What was back in my day was totally different but I do understand what your saying. In the late 70s and early mid 80s there was a lot of transition and the only reason those glam bands came around was because of music television and the entertainment managers wanted to take advantage of that shit so there solution on making $$$$ was slap a bunch of make up on guys and have them sing about fuckin girls. Whilst the metal community was like this is bullshit!! That's when the term "POSER" took affect and was used a lot by the big 4. There literally was a all out fuckin battle no shit! Against the Glam- fucks and true hard rock/metal bands. Your guys generation have takin it to a different level definitely more civilized. My generation was a pissed of generation and would have kicked the shit out of a poser/elitist. But I absolutely understand my brother and at this point and time I don't care either. All right in my eyes too as long as you don't harass me about shit. Ha Ha!!

Metaldemon

As far as the War against Metheads and glam asses. It was brutal where I live as well as in California along the westcoast, Imagine a small Biker gang trying to hangout with a bunch of Hell Angels charter members No Shit!! That's what it was like! Jackets where burned patches where ripped off people would get pile drived it was a crazy ass period in time. Thrash metal was brand new. You guys should have been there. Really fucked up! But Fun!!!

kimo

Well judging by all your comments about all us glam asses, you are exactly what I would consider you a metal elitist. What gives you the right to beat people and destroy their stuff just because they listen to a different style of music than you.
In the 80's I would have fit perfectly into your stereo type of a poser, but did it ever occur to you that not everyone is so narrow minded. I was regularly attending glam shows as well as punk/ hardcore shows and plenty of the heaviest bands Australia had to offer at the time.
Never had a problem at the punk shows dressed as I was, but always ran into the knuckle draggers at the thrash shows. I always likened these guys to the skinheads as they were real tough guys in a pack, but would piss themselves one on one.

Take a look through the battle jacket gallery here and see how many jackets have glam poser patches on the same jackets as Slayer and an array of other heavy shit. Are all these people posers as well, or just people who have the balls and courage to fucken listen to and represent what they want to listen to.

I remember back in the eighties when all the thrash heads and bands started coming to all the glam shows because that's where all the women were. There was certainly very few women at their shows in those days....just a massive sausage fest.
I also remember seeing Mortal Sin once, supposedly Australias premier thrash metal band, with a glam band De'mont supporting them just to increase the crowd size and also bring in some women. So they were all willing to embrace the glam scene for their own gain.

I just don't get why it gets up peoples asses so much what other people listen to
Personally I don't surround myself with such narrow minded people. My friends and I attend glam / metal / punk shows all the time and could not imagine having to limit ourselves to just one genre to fit in with the cool kids.

Metaldemon

Ok man whoooaaa grab a FOSTERS MATE!! I'm talking about 30 fuckin years ago bud! Not today and I'm reflecting on past experiences here! In the U.S.A not what would happen today. If you like Glam fuckin go for it man!!! This post is about distinguishing an elitist I'm not and elitist I'm a fuckin old guy from the 80s understanding what's been going on in the world of metal today I'm not skinhead I'm half Native American and a former Marine and as for my little gang of Satans misguided children I used to hang with back in the 80s, you fought the fights you started. I would give Rats ass what the hell you listen to today or what patches you have on your vest/jacket. my daughter listens to R&B and my wife listens to country. And I remember thrash bands going glam shows too but would end up in a fight over here Aussie man. So your experience is different fuckin fine lets agree to disagree and call it good. I still listen to my old shit and I listen to my nephews new shit I don't care what you hear if it makes you squirt your shorts go for it dude!

kimo

Ok no problem man. I've got no beef. Maybe I misunderstood. I saw you mention it early on when this thread first started and couldn't really be bothered replying but you seem to keep mentioning it again and again so I got the impression that it was still a sentiment you held.
Was never implying you were a skinhead or anything, was just commenting on the people I came across who shared that type of attitude.
But anyway you asked what a Metal Elitist was , so in my opinion comments like that was a shining example of it.

Anyway, it's all good. No problems.

And just for the record. No good Aussie blokes drinks Fosters. We leave that shit for the English backpackers. Haha

Metaldemon

Ok mate no worries its all good. I actually liked Fosters!! HA HA But I LIKE ALL BEER!! Yeah glam pricks and fuckin metalheads posers is all I got when it comes to a relation to elitist. But its nice to hear from somebody who's experienced the same kinda shit back then. Fair dinkum!! and stay metal brada!!!

Nater90

I agree, Fosters is horse piss.

vikingdantheman

^ "beer elitists"
haha.

Nater90

Got that right mate haha.

Ravishing Grimness

A Metal Elists is someone 100% dedicated towards the scene.It has nothing to do with something political or racists from what i have learned.They have high respect for the person as the music he/she believes in.

DonLittleDuck

Elitist is the term used by idiots refering to the person who corrected them on calling Amon Amarth viking metal.

Metaldemon

I've got to listen to this band. I hear people talking about it and see patches about them all over the place.

Goathammer

Listen to Enslaved instead.

Metaldemon

Migard, loki, living beneath the hammer heard those lyrics. Badass!

metalmaciejmetal

What is the argument being made? To me Viking metal isn't a genre. Amon Amarth is a melodic death metal band. Viking is just a theme of the songs. I don't think that's really an elitist thing. Genres describe the sound more than the themes

DonLittleDuck

Exatly my point. Lyrics don't define a genre, musical characteristics does. Amon Amarth isn't viking metal, just how Alestorm is not pirate metal because these are made-up names for putting bands in certain brackets based on their lyrical themes.

metalmaciejmetal

Ok, so we are in agreement. The pirate metal thing... yeah that's a gimmick not a genre. I've had to explain the genres to some non-metal friends that told me they discovered Alestorm. I don't know if that makes one an "elitist" or not.

These goofy titles remind me in the early 2000s and late 90s how every nu metal band while being interviewed made up some sort of subgenre that only describes their band. One band does not a subgenre make

Metaldemon

Pirate metal??? Ha Ha Ha! What the fuck!!?? What's next caveman metal? Lol!!!!

Nater90

Oh yeah Pirate Metal is a thing, I do like Alestorm, Seen them three times.

But certain themes / styles become so popular they class it as a genre, Just like Djent, Djent is a style of how you play the guitar / how it's tuned, So many bands started doing it they made it a genre.

Always going to happen if you like it or not.

Metaldemon

Yeah I'm just an old 80s kid so this stuff is hilarious but very interesting man I'm definitely not dissing anything. I'm learning a lot on this forum!! . so Djent! Huh? Never heard of that either. Ill youtube it!

Nater90

Would've loved to grown up in the 80s, Amazing era.

Yeah, Djent haha, It's different....I like some.

Metaldemon

Growing up in the 70s and transitioning to the 80s and into the Seattle grunge era 90s was very intriguing. A lot of freggin changing my brada!!

Nater90

You would have seen the birth of many bands and even genres!!!

Metaldemon

I have seen many bands beginning and many bands that became very famous from there beginnings in the 70s. There wasn't many metal genres as today but I witnessed a lot of beginnings and infantsy. Then Grunge emerged! I live in Seattle wa. USA so I witnessed how metal kinda took a back seat for awhile. Yeah pretty fuckin kool back in the day. A lot different than today we where some wild Mother fuckers back then. Lol!!

Nater90

Man that's so cool!

I don't mind a bit of Grunge here and there.

Haha, Sounds good man.

Metaldemon

Thanks Nater90! Stay metal brada!!

Nater90

Most welcome, Thanks bro, You to \m/

JUANTHRASH
Rotten

Im a metal elitist and I'm proud of it. Sorry, but i hate most modern metal and I'm not afraid of telling someone they suck. Its only recently (last 2-3 years) that this has been cemented. Prior, a persons bands of choice was their decision and if it made them happy - good for them. But now, especially the emo turned metal fan fan who tells me my music is old and the bands i listen to are shit because its not pig squealing ... well, I'm sorry but fuck you! And ill kick 8 colours of shit out of you if you get into my face about it. Its the fan themselves more so than the tunes they listen too - emotional little fags - PC left - everything i say is offensive and they need their safe space to bra blah blah ... when the fuck did metal fans become see fucking weak? When did all this shit start? So yeah, I'm an elitist - more than likely that bands you listen to are shit (just like you). Its time to kick these tourists out of the scene we created. We don't want this shit around. Crush, kill, destroy.

Nater90

Well said mate.

metalmaciejmetal

What more needs to be said? Exactly. I love the term "tourist" it perfectly describes tge outsiders that want to see what a scary Watain concert actually is after reading the article in TMZ.

Rotten

The fag tourists will disappear when the next 'fad' swings by.

Rotten

Im actually surprised that agree with me. Ive said the same on other sites and on Facebook and have been chastised for it. You know the people I'm talking about - that guy in the Burzum shirt with the big ear spacer shit hanging from his head thats pro antifa - FUCKING WHAT?! Confused children that need a good fucking hosing and given their marching orders to fuck off. Elitist and proud.

Metaldemon

Being and old fucker I can relate. Trust me my Aussie friend. I've brought up around the days of Glam-fags and Posers, I'm not offended by your statement I actually relate, you sound more like a traditionalist like me. So I'm kool with that. But again I was brought up with a lot the original pioneering bands and the group I hung out with back in the day I guess you guys would call them elitists now, but we just liked the traditional shit and the new shit, I would givin a fuck about new wave or fuckin MTV or any of that shit back then. The people we hated was the Poser that wore a thrash band shirt or a fuckin button or what not but didn't have a fuckin clue what the band was about listen to any of the music or what it messages. I've said it before and I'll say it fuckin again our metal culture is a brother/sisterhood a club and if you didn't understand the music or the people behind it you where a fucking lost cause
Get the fuck out. But I'm with you Rotten.
But now having a daughter that likes other music and crap I can't be to critical anymore she's her own person she just thinks Daddy is cranky old mother fucker that hates everybody!! Ha Ha Ha !!! . Id say though listen to what you want but make sure the people you intend on hanging around with have the same interest or we are gonna see right through your ASS!! . I still hold high regard to the old music back then and I still do now. My nephew listens to the new stuff but It just is not my flava! I'm not gonna beat him up on it. He's a weird kid anyway.

Blüdrayne

Out of curiosity, did you hear the term tourist from somewhere specific?

Metaldemon

My question too? What's a tourist?

Rotten

It's a term I came up with. I refer to a tourist as the person that only likes metal for a short period because it's in fashion and popular - not a life long member or dedicated to it. People that will jump on the next fad once it swings by. These people usually only like the newer bands and shit talk about the originators ... Today's posers.

Metaldemon

Understood my brotha!! So its a short termed mother fucker and a Poser everything I hated back then and now.

Influx

If I learned anything about "metal elitists" most of the bad ones end up being those tourists like Rotten said. I've had enough hipsters listen to one band's album then suddenly they think they are some sort of metal god. It isn't too hard for someone to educate themselves about metal's roots but apparently...

hell I even still got a lot to learn but I am not about to put up a false face when I am wrong.

But folks who have actually seen the rise of it all, be as elitist as you want because I see no problem there at all. That's a completely different creature.

Metaldemon

Well I was there when a lot of bands rose and died in the early 80s to 90s but I don't want to be an elitist I just listen to kool shit I'm used to and don't mind being curious about some of the new shit (post-2000 era) I guess. I just think if you like what you like fine but don't push your shit on to me or other people. As far as my era goes it was a lot different we had the problem of Glam-fags and MTV burning a fuckin hole in true metal with the fuckin posers coming out with there gay ass makeup hair spray and putting a Fuckin Cherry pie warrant shirt on and saying " hey where heavy metal!! Duuuhhhh!!" whatever! But that was a different time. I appreciate your statement Influx!!

Influx

Amen to that!

I still hope your nephew had a good time at the show!

Metaldemon

Oh yeah he did, we all are going to a show again here in the next couple of days and we all bought tickets to Metallica for August 9th here in Seattle I don't have a problem with his friends they just look at me as the old wise one or some shit . I honestly am forgetting a lot of stuff. Oh well. Stay metal Brada!!!

Metaldemon

Put you on my kool friend list!!! Ha Ha!

grulog

The term "Metal Elitist" is just used to shit on a person without any social consequences. I've written a few articles detailing it on my blog Metal Stuff.

For people who bitch about Metal Elitism/Elitists
https://metalstuff.net/2016/06/21/quit-your-bitching-metal-elitists-are-...

The inherent hypocrisy of hating on Elitism in metal.
https://metalstuff.net/2016/11/16/does-hating-on-metal-elitists-make-you...

Metaldemon

Ok when was the term " ELITIST" first used? Is my generation of Metal (1979-1991) a cause of this terminology? Or is from the rebirth of the genre aka Nu- metal from the early/mid 90s?. Its interesting to me that this new generation has a type of traditionalism that sorta respects the roots of my generation of music and then has group that doesn't like some of the real new stuff, kinda like back in the day of Metal headbangers like myself and the Glam-fags from back in the day. I find all Metal today just interesting to listen to, my nephew has albums from artists you guys listen to that I have never heard of but don't I don't dis him for it its just different his friends just think I'm an interesting old fucker from back in the day and they are around in there 20s early 30s, Lol!!. The comments on this thread are interesting as fuck! There definitely is a rift so to speak in your guys metal tastes today between people? I hope this is a accurate observation?. I know Fuckyeah is a member on this forum from Australia and would find this thread interesting as fuck cause he's putting a book of metal stories and history together!

grulog

See, the term is a social construct from well after the nu-metal era. Actually, you can trace it to right around the time the New Wave of American Metal started dying down (so within the past 7ish years give or take). The new metal news outlets (since the 'zines died out) are pretty much exclusively metal websites like Metal Sucks, Metal Injection, and Lambgoat - and they thrive off of the popularity they get from both the poser metal bands and the controversy surrounding including them (and their fans) in the metal scene. If you read the comments on this thread - you'll notice a pattern. Everyone who hates metal elitists has their own personal definition of what they are - which means it's meaningless insult that people just dump the things about some asshole they don't like into and use it to disrespect people who remind them of that individual.

That's pretty much why I started my own blog/website - I figure I can't be the only person who doesn't want to hear regurgitated industry-sponsored crap. I figured it was time for a new incarnation of the independent 'zine to come back through. I prefer to focus on metal culture (for the most part), because I think that's something that's both interesting and under-discussed.

You're 100% correct in the observation that there is a rift in metal, it's an incarnation of the old underground/mainstream thing that's been going since the 80's but it's a bit more fractured.

Metaldemon

fractured doesnt sound good, i hope people are reading these comments and are learning some of the implications of division in a culture. To take it as it is and build off of it and not be to critical. I dont want to sound too fuckin hypicritical cause of my past dislike of Glam-crap! but I sure would like to do my part in preserving our metal culture and not divide ourselves into another extinction event like what happenend in the late 80s. i read your blog and you do hit on some VERY good points. As a older Metalhead I can appreciate that grulog.

Metaldemon

another thing is talking to my nephew an elitist is a preservationist of our culture and has more of a historical and definition of the culture? is this correct? and is this why his friends looked at me as if im the person that had the answers?, but he was telling me to that him and his friends dont meet to many diehard metalheads from back in the day either and they usually dont like talking to much when im around. whats that all about? or they just being idiots?

grulog

Well, fractured is good and bad. It's weird, it's like it's more unified but at the same time a lot more spread out and a little watered down. Most people still carry the flag, but there's a lot of "metal tourists" who listen for a few years and bow out. what i refer to as an elitist would certainly be that, a longtime die hard participant/member of the culture.

however, when elitist is used against a person (like how a lot of people here understand the word) they're using the word "elitist" in place of "asshole". So, like, the gatekeeper guys who see you wearing a band shirt and quiz you on the history of the band would be an example. It sounds like the term as it was used towards him was something closer to that - but as a real head you tend to get that a lot if you so much as correct someone anymore (like, if someone said metallica was a death metal band - i'd get called an elitist if i told them they were wrong, and that metallica plays thrash).

i've been called an elitist for saying Lynyrd Skynyrd isn't metal, so the term is thrown around very loosely.

the friends are probably a tad intimidated running into an original gangster of metal. they'll get over it.

Metaldemon

Ha Ha. I think you sir ANSWERED my question on this whole thread and I appreciate it. I kinda had the feeling a Elitist was probably used in a wrong context and is what I thought, a preservationist historical correctness of our fine culture!! Ok. So I hope everybody that's reading this understands what I'm understanding. An Elitist is not an Asshole trying to tell you what to listen to or give you shit cause of what you wear! That's and asshole metalhead!! And a TRUE Elitist is just a devout Metalhead that his interests are more of a preserving and historical. I'm all for that!! Thanks Grulog my brother!!

Metaldemon

Oh yeah!! Lynard Skynard is NOT METAL that's one of my dads favorite bands. And I definitely can back you up on that one 100%. There punk/folk/country all in one. Free bird, sweet home alabama, simple man, gone from Tuesday just to name a few. That ain't METAL and who ever is giving you shit haven't heard there music and is just a dumb fuck!!!. Very kool band but not metal!! As Ronnie James Dio would say " played in the wrong key!!!"

Morbid_Welshman

I was once called one simply for knowing more about the band on the other guys shirt, which I found quite funny. (He approached me wearing the same Bathory shirt) Proudly announcing "I've seen them live four times" to which I almost choked on my Beer and laughed "No....you fucking haven't..." hahahahahahah!

Metaldemon

See that's what I'm talking about! You just corrected a guy and called him out on his fuckin bullshit now your labeled an Elitist!? In which Grulog was just stating that that's not what an Elitist is. Yeah if some mother fuckin 30year-old came up to me with a 1985 Iron Maiden original Live after Death shirt and said they were there id drop kick that motha fucka over my house!! AND ITS HAPPENED TO ME BEFORE! And its annoying as hell!! I hear ya Morbid_Welshman my brother!!!

Nater90

Hahahaha oh shit, What a tosser!!!!

I'd sell my left nut to have seen them once if I was around back then, Would've been amazing.

grulog

They say 10,000 hours of doing something makes you an expert. That's doing something 20 hours a week, for 50 weeks out of the year, for 10 years.

I've been listening to metal for over 20 years - not as long as some, but a lot longer than most of the people I run into. And there hasn't been a single day since I was 13 years old that I've listened to metal for less than 3 hours a day. Quite the contrary - I picked a job where I can listen to metal for 8 hours a day, then go home and listen in my personal time.

So, not in a "holier than thou" sort of way, but I think that someone who's put that much time into listening to metal develops a critical enough ear (not to mention all the bands, genres, song/lyrics, etc dedicated to memory) to be considered an expert at it. And as such, when they talk about metal they're giving an expert opinion. I think an expert opinion holds a lot more weight than an average opinion.

If someone who put that much time into ANYTHING besides metal were to weigh in and correct someone for giving mistakenly false opinions on something (or for blowing smoke) - it's considered par for course. Experience trumps everything. That's my two cents when it comes to metal elitism - it's a bunch of whiny millennials who want to play "scene tourist" and get a participation trophy without putting in any effort or learning anything.

Metaldemon

Expierence in the music as well as the historical provenance. And as you said previously as an older metalhead I can distinguish a tourist vs. a true person dedicated to the lifestyle or genre. I think I'm starting to lean towards Elitism seems like a true Elitist doesn't mean Harm but just critiques the key and the music itself. But as you said in your Blog that there are metalhead assholes and therefore I believe is the distinguishing factor that everybody need to be aware of. I've had millenials try to say Iron Maiden is thrash or Overkill is Heavy to twist it around and correct those people that Iron Maiden has always been Heavy metal and Overkill is Thrash. But back in the day if somebody ask me told me that same thing I would've told to "fuck off you Poser!!! Lol! But now its more of an Old guy talking old-school with the newer generation.

andermatten

somebody probably already said this but most metalheads are metal elitists. they consider their genre (including subgenres) to be superior over others, say, pop or reggae, italo disco or eurodance.

Metaldemon

heavy metal, is a absolutely different music all around from disco, and reggae man! i dont have an interest in that music at all. and therefore dont have any expierence with it and not to sound like a metalhead asshole but i wouldnt give shit about other music other than old timey country [ aka. Johnny Cash, Conway twitty etc. etc.} but again i dont consider myself a proffesional in country either. As said a true Metalhead/headbanger of my time just stick with what we grew up on and careless about other stuff. But hey! if somebody likes listening to R & B like my daughter go for it! im not gonna say your misguded unless you ask for my opinion. Lol!!! . So andermatten if somebody is coming up to you and saying that italo disco or eurodance is shit, you need to tell them to fuck off! thats not a metalhead thats just a complete fuckin jackass thats lookin for a good asskicking! . I will not cratique your music your lifestyle what you eat how you dress or anything. thats all YOU! my Brother! no worries!!!

deadlock

Elitist is kinda a bullshit term really, its lost its meaning for the most part. It is fairly rare that anyone who gets called one will actually identify as an elitist. Its just a term people throw around when someone has a harsh opinion of a band they like. They just dismiss it with "that's an elitist opinion", so they don't have to actually consider any criticize made by them.

People who hate elitists are generally casuals or misguided people who confuse idiots/assholes for elitists. But contrary to the opinions of the misguided only liking band's who play at certain speeds or whatever and hating other's for not doing the same, isn't an elitist opinion. It's an idiots opinion. In reality elitism isn't inherently a bad thing, elitism is caring enough about the genre to have strong opinions on it. Elitism is thinking the knowledge's opinion's are more valuable than casual listeners of the genre, and the less knowledgeable should show them respect and listen and learn. Of course this annoys many less knowledgeable people who want to be just as important without actually caring enough to learn what the fuck they are talking about. And yes elitists can be idiots or assholes too, but that's not what makes them an elitist. And calling stupid opinions, "elitist" opinions, really grinds my gears. Its such a bullshit way to dismiss their opinion.

Basically just ignore anyone who throw elitist around as an insult, especially in black metal. That genre was made specifically for elitists and anyone who says otherwise probably hasn't looked into it enough to have a valid opinion anyway.

grulog

I agree, it just gets thrown around by scene tourists to make themselves feel good for not knowing what they're talking about.

deadlock

Scene tourist is a great term for them.

If they don't want to actually discuss the merits of a band, and just call someone an elitist for criticizing them. Why are they even discussing music in the first place? They aren't even trying to learn from the discussion, its disgusting, lazy and most ironically rather arrogant to assume their views are just as valid when they don't care to learn what they are talking about.

Metaldemon

What is a scene tourist? A Poser?

grulog

Eh, poser is a good word for it. That's what they would have been called in the 80's and 90's - but the term has pretty much dried up in common metal vernacular. Someone who is "just passing through", trying metal on for a little while and thinking just being "there" and being a fan of metal makes their opinions (as uneducated as they may be) as important as people who have been around and keeping metal alive for 20-30 years.

Metaldemon

I Gotcha!!! Thanks Grulog.

metalmaciejmetal

This reminds me, back when I was a teenager in the early 2000s, once I broke away from Nu Metal and started to explore the various Scandinavian bands I would look up to what would be called metal elitists. This would be guys in their mid to late 20s that would enlighten me on what was real metal. I realized I knew very little so at shows between bands I would listen to these guys opinions, listen to their stories, look up the bands on their tshirts. I viewed "elitists" as some sort of wise sages.

Maybe people that have no interest in truly exploring and diving deep into the heavy metal universe use this term as a pejorative to dismiss the people that truly live for metal.

grulog

No doubt, crying "elitist" is literally an entry-level defense mechanism.

Metaldemon

Awsome responses! And this makes perfect sense to me! I find it fuckin interesting to go thru the 70s and 80s to late 80s early grunge and never heard the term . but it sounds like you guys and my nephew are in tuned to the preservation of the genre and culture and as the old dude have no problem with it. I can't speak for the rest of my generation of headbangers but I would think its kind of an honor.

MetalHorror

Whenever Ive talked shit about deathcore saying its false metal ive been called "closed minded" and "elitist"

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