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Fri, 01/06/2012 - 13:27 — 
Hárbarðr
Ok, i know this is kinda off-topic here, but here it goes:
Christianity is a recurring topic in Metal in general, and in the more extreme genres in particular, and a huge part of that attention this religion recieves is "negative": criticism, mockery and insult (which i have nothing against to). Many people in the metal world see Christianity as some kind of "utter nemesis" to all what metal is, represents and expresses.
But i find curious that , while everyone talks about Christianity, nobody seems to even notice this other monotheistic, universalist religion, and very few "Anti-Islamic" bands exist, in comparison to the legions of "anti-chrisitan" outfits.
I think Islam is EVEN WORSE than Christianity, and if the latter is the utter opposition of Metal, then the former is a fucking über Nemesis on a super strong kind of steroids.
So, what do you guys think of Islam??
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Rotten said: Thanx dude ... Even this lay out has changed slightly. And it will probably change once again. I have a lot of patches to choose from :) No, no front just yet. None of these patches in the pic are sewn on - I only sewed the back patch on last night. And im still waiting on a few patches to arrive in the mail. This will take a while to put together because ill only get to work on it when I have some spare time.
hammer slammer said: Fucking awesome! Love the S.O.D and Metallica strip, Spiritual Healing and of course the backpatch! No front?
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Comments
Death to all these Idiots RELIGION ALWAS DID IS AND ALWAYS WILL SUCK
Yeah!! Fuck them!
I think it's stupid and oppressing just like Christianity, but I have nothing against Muslims themselves unless they're extremists
Christianity doesn't practice as much oppression as is in the "good book", where as Muslims do. "Women should be silent in the churches, for they are not permitted to speak, but should be submissive, as the law also says." (1 Corinthians 14:34) ect is found but now ignored in christianity... it's funny that christianity ignores certain verses like this basically to go mainstream and so more people are apt to agree and fallow it (like blind ass sheep).
Religion is the best system set up by the first governments to keep it's citizens in line. Religion is only in place so people will hold them selves morally accountable, and easily manipulated. I use to be Catholic, I even went through confirmation. The more I learned about Christianity, the more I realized what a sham it is lol. We make these gods so we don't feel alone and so we don't have a fear of death/the unknown.
I don't see how Islam is worse than Christianity. Maybe culturally, you have a problem with Middle Eastern practices more than Western ones.
They enforce oppression of women much more vigorously, have far more extreme views (the penalty for apostasy is death)- not to mention the purely religious-based suicide bombings. Christianity is benign in comparison.
People too often blur the lines of culture and religion. Of course, religion can play a big role in culture, but the radicalism and oppression seen in the Middle East are more a result of culture rather than the religion of Islam, which is why I have a problem with people saying things like Islam is worse than Christianity. Grouping Muslims collectively with "they" when speaking of radical views is extremely unfair.
The religion of Islam hasn't evolved as Christianity has- while inequality to women and homosexuals is still part of bible scripture, it usually isn't preached. You're right in saying that culture plays a very large part- though I'd argue that certain Middle Eastern cultures are more influenced by religion than you're saying- I don't think it can fairly or evenly be compared to Christianity's influence on modern Western culture.
This is because Western culture is ingrained into your lifestyle. Christian influences do not jump out at you and do not seem foreign, but natural to the point of often forgetting or not even knowing of their true origin. Judging foreigners or a foreign concept is much easier than oneself or one's own views.
Hey I think forcing women to wear burqas to cover their faces or giving them poorer education and work opportunities is more restrictive than being forced to swear on the bible in court or using the Christian (or Gregorian) calendar. The extent of Christian-based restriction in Christian-based countries is the restriction over homosexual marriage- although that's soon to change in many areas and countries where it's still outlawed.
I'm still concerned over Christianity's influence over American politics, among other things, but Christianity is a comparatively benign religion.
Christianity is responsible for genocide of civilizations and of other religions. Look at the Crusades. Now what effect does this have on modern-day Western culture? Xenophobia and a sense of entitlement and superiority.
Hey I'm not arguing for Christianity, I'm arguing for atheism- however the main thrust of my argument is that Christianity today is benign on the whole compared to Islam.
Yes, I understand that. I agree that everyday Christianity is not as harmful as radical Islam. It seems that you believe that all Muslims are radical and are ignorant or plain ignoring radical Christianity.
Everyday Western Christianity is not as culturally harmful as everyday Middle Eastern Islam, is what I'm saying.
Probably because Islam gets a lot more hate in Western or European culture, yet there seems to be this protective shield around Christianity where people aren't allowed to offend.
Similar reason as to why there are plenty of lyrics negatively dealing with shitty politics, compared to negatively dealing with mass-murdering baby rapists.
I'm just personally against all religion. I don't think any of it is necessary, and definitely not worth it. None of it works, all it does is preach peace and deliver the exact opposite. I say fuck all religion and all religious figures. Death to it all!!!
there's a few anti-islamic bands popping up into the mainstream now too, my prediction is that it will be the next 'hot thing' :)
I hope to see equal numbers of tshirts with "FUCK [insert_religion]" here at metal festivals in the future
Haha, that would be like suicide to wear a shirt that says "Fuck Islam" on the back, in big tough guy letters. But anyway, yes, all religions are not being hated equally for some reason.
He died for Religion .. hahah
Yep, the question is how many will have the guts to wear anti-Islam stuff... there has been a letter from a reader of Metal Maniacs mag a few years ago published in the mag, precisely about this issue. Everyone in metal is daft to pick on Christianity, but are they doing it only cause it's so tame now and it's so safe to beat a dead horse? The more religious someone is, the more forgiving, after all, and the less vengeful about such insults. But take Islam: a serious fighter religion, they put their swords where their mouth is and walk the walk. Look the wrong way at them and you have a fatwa for life which will be now shorter. How many anti-religious folks in metal would dare to mess with this bunch of fighter fanatics? Yet Islam today is exactly the embodiment of religion gone too far out of bounds. So that's an interesting question to pose to metal folks... Inverted crosses are safe, but anti-Allah and anti-Mosque patches can get someone's ass kicked in the back alley, are people brave enough to wear these if they claim so hard to be anti-religious? or are they only into it because it's safe to pick on harmless Christians who won't touch them?
Already happening:
http://shop-hellsheadbangers.com/item.asp?PID=22351
http://asatruversand.com/__shop/product_info.php/info/p1588_Anti-Islam--...
http://asatruversand.com/__shop/product_info.php/info/p391_Odin-statt-Al...
and I get a kick out of this album cover every time:
http://www.metal-archives.com/images/2/8/7/6/287616.jpg
Talk about equal-opportunity offenders, how polite to include everyone :D
Seriously laughed at that cover xD
You never hear about modern Christians killing people for blaspheming. You do, on the other hand, unfortunately hear things like that about Islam. I have known Muslims before, and they were very nice people. I have never met any Muslims who were violent. I don't hate entire groups of people, but if anyone wants to destroy my values and culture, then it's homicide time. Just kidding, but I would hate the fuck out of them, and I would record BM about killing them or something.
Before I go on and before anyone reads(if they read) what I am about to say, I can’t stress enough this following statement: I equally hate all desert variety theism and organized religion in general. I don't really hate people themselves, unless they give me a reason to, but I detest many aspects of human nature. Until I get to know everyone around me and their ideas, we are all rather annoying parasites of this rock called earth. However, whether it’s: Islam, Jehovah's Witness, Christianity, Judaism, Shafi'i , etc I do stand against individuals when they allow their practices to infiltrate the fabric of either law, rights or other socio-economic structures.
So subjectively, what I am about to talk about may be deemed as just an opinion, however I will try to speak as reasonable but factually as I can:
Islam presents a sinister veil more so than Christianity in most modern societies with both European and Western cultures, but it can mask it in such an effective way, that most simpletons either ignore it, or if it's questioned...they deem it as "intolerance" during modern times. Both systems disgust me... If I was to go in full detail as to why I hate all theism and organized, ignorant religious sects, it would probably take up several pages. However, I will share some thoughts on this issue. First of all, most Islamic law, is nothing short of an abomination. There is simply no other way to look at it, because it's the truth. Traditional Muslims that understand the Quran and the hadith, believe that Islamic law(Sharia),expresses the highest and best goals for all societies. It is after all, "the will of Allah". However many of the rites from this law and fetid religion promote violence (whether under Jihad or not) and intolerance, especially against religions of other people and women. It might not be noticeable with regards to the more peaceful practitioners, but the more traditional you go, the more rooted to this archaic system it becomes.
Islamic social structure, has fewer incidents of fornication and adultery because of strict "fair" laws or customs. However, these customs and methods based on the religious cave man ways of the old, do nothing but oppress. We have women wearing veils/tents over their faces and whole body, who have been brainwashed into thinking it's a part of the religion, or that it's acceptable....NO..it's not! Then the same laws also keep these women separate from men in social settings, hence forth, results of fewer incidents of sexual 'crimes' may have unanticipated negative effects in other areas of the paradigm. Sharia restricts women's social mobility, living quality and rights, the more closely sharia is followed to it's original roots. A recent and long standing example, would be that in conservative Saudi Arabia women are not allowed to drive cars..they are not deemed "intelligent" enough, nor is it the will of Allah. In Iran, similar laws oppress women and enact violent and quick revenge if the male dominant society is challenged. Women's testimony counts less than half that of men and far more women than men are stoned to death for adultery, stealing, or other crimes...often in the name of higher Islamic faith and Allah.
Islam often orders death for Muslim and possible death for non Muslim critics of Muhammad and the Quran and even Sharia itself. There is no space for people to make up their own minds, because like many varieties of theosophical life styles, it relies on indoctrination and the blind leading the blind. Sharia law and Islamic radical religious sects, oppresses the citizens of Islamic countries and try to warp the societies of other countries to be tolerant to their stupid practices, even if it comes at the cost of hurting another countries way of life (case in point, France...seriously watch some videos on how the social structure there is being terrorized by tribal and intolerant behaviour from Immigrants, it's both sad and truly angering). Islam must either be reformed ,or be abolished for what it is defined from scriptures that are out dated. However, given the era we lie in and the reality of the situation as a whole, I highly doubt that the legal hierarchy in Islamic nations will do this because the judges, Islamic high officials and legal scholars understand the cost to their way of life-
Countless passages within the Quran and the hadith must be rejected for the false things they teach and this they cannot do according to the people that uphold this way of life. ...I mean, hey.. the Quran came down directly from Allah through Gabriel, so says traditional theology, So how can Islam reform? That would be too much to ask, now wouldn’t it?
Basically, though I usually take no issue with the people that follow these blinded faiths, I also have no time to respect ignorance from any human, merely I have to make an effort to co exist with an reasonable way, but any person belonging to Islam, or any Christian sect, for that matter, raising as much as an eyebrow over what I’ve just stated above, is a hypocritical, mindless, sycophantical troglodyte.
Time for Janaza http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zfb9EXCoKwM&feature=BFa&list=AVNfBR8pcF-3...
"Sycophantical troglodyte", HAHAHA!
"Sycophantical" just doesn't look or sound right, lol.
I love all your papers Tico XD
+1
+2
+1 to all of this.
Much of this view of Islam is actually outmoded, a dead corpse propped up by the ruling class to maintain the status quo. It's just like if the church still required animal sacrifices. Or it's basically what would have happened if the Amish were militant.
I personally know quite a few muslims.
I have read the koran out of academic interest.
Islam as a religion is no better and no worse than any other, including christianity.
The modern perception of islam has nothing to do with true islam, and everything to do with misguided extremism.
Still, Islam IS an organised religion with a power structure that places humans over other humans. Just like every other. As such it is inevitable it will be abused for human gratification. As such, I am against all organised religion.
Hey, isn't there already a band playing Jihad metal: Meads of Asphodel who did a split with Mayhem once. Crazy Muslim dudes from the UK. Mayhem liked them and supported them apparently because they're radical and anti-Christian. Which brings up an interesting question... Are the anti-religious masses in metal in fact nothing more but closet Christian-haters?
Correct me if I'm wrong, and maybe I'm mixing things up, but didn't Varg once in some interview actually express support for radical Islam, again because it's so radical and anti-social? You never see major black metal "icons" dissing Islam in public eye... Could it be because it's become so safe and so secure to diss Christianity these days, a religion whose mass respect is on decline anyway and whose Vatican power is already waning? You don't lose anything by dissing Christianity, and Christians will maybe sigh and wring their hands and maybe put you on Norwegian TV and nothing more.
Frankly I think all those anti-religious metal folks who diss Christianity but respect Islam for being so radical and evil and kvlt are fucking themselves in the ass. Extremist Islam today is exactly what Extremist Christianity was in Medieval times: radical and evil and kvlt, full of blood and antisocial awesomeness for dismantling the pagan world order and establishing a brutal empire of Christ. But no one looks at it like that, everyone is like, "boohoo evil bad Christianity!" Everyone I know personally who disses religion uses the acts of medieval Church for examples of religious fanaticism, intolerance, etc, which goes completely against those people's modern progressive noble sensibilities, it offends their civilized senses. How come those people are not anti-Islam then?! Simply cowardice, I think... It is incredibly safe to be anti-Christian these days. But try being anti-Christian in medieval times and you get Inquisition on your ass. Try being anti-Islam nowadays and you get fatwa on your ass. Anyone who claims to be anti-religious but does not dole out equal criticism for radical Islam is a hypocrite in my book. It's actually quite pathetic to see these metal dudes endorsing radical Islam for being anti-Christian and anti-social. It's like wimpy alley dogs kissing the asses of ferocious alpha wolves: "OMG we're on your side don't bite us!!!" When in fact come reckoning time, those "metal commandos" will be among the first to get popped, because Islam looks hella down on metal degeneracy and sees metal as an enemy to culture (ask any metal folks who are actually from those countries).
Something to consider for anti-religion people when looking into their mirrors: do they hate Christianity because it's safe, or do they actually have the balls to stand up for their beliefs and dare to criticize radical Islam for being EXACTLY what they hate Christianity for?
This hits the nail on the head. It's simply so hip and safe to hate Christians now. Perhaps Muslims might be next on the hate list for the mainstream.
Very, very true. Not to mention that some non-muslims would instantly swing the axe of "intolerance" on you, and call you "bigoted" and even "racist". Nobody would even think about doing the same to critics of Christianity.
Actually, that's likely because when people think of Muslims, there is a certain face they envision, one of a specific ethnicity. When people think of Christians, they normally don't. Hatred towards Muslims can result in prejudice towards all or many people of a certain ethnicity whereas you don't really see that with Christians, at least in America. I cannot say that this is true for all countries.
Good point. I never really see Muslims that aren't Arab looking. Although I have heard of it. The Norwegian BM band "Ancient" has a guy who declared the Islam faith and moved to live with his female band mate who was Muslim as well, or something like that. But that is about the only case I have ever heard of when it comes to non-Arab people being Muslim.
There are plenty of African American Muslims. But yes, the ethnic prejudice that often arises from hating on religions like Islam and Judaism is why I am more suspect when people say they hate all Muslims and Jews than Christians. The "it's safe to hate Christians" is not why I raise an eyebrow to much of the Islam bashing, it's the inclination towards prejudice base on one's ethnicity whilst doing so that makes me more critical.
You're right, those ethnic prejudices are absolutely wrong, and in fact they are the cause of the retarded censorship when someone criticizes Islam: they all claim you're "being racist", when in fact you're attacking a religion, not an ethnicity.
actually in my country there is a specific demographic more likely to be associated with christianity. christianity is commonly looked at as a westernised religion. therefore christians are more often than not elitist upper middle class people from english speaking backgrounds. its more of a classist thing than a racialist thing here.
"Anyone who claims to be anti-religious but does not dole out equal criticism for radical Islam is a hypocrite in my book."
YES! Precisely. Oh..and next month I'll be seeing an 'Inquisition', just not one of the bloody torso skewering variety, more so one of a musical variety.
On the new Taake album, Hoest did pen some anti-islamic lyrics that got some people riled up when it was nominated for some Norwegain award. He is not an 'icon' like Varg or Fenriz, but still very prominent within the genre.
This doesn't requite long ass responses. Islam and all RHP religions suck. End of story.
Im against all that Right-hand patch and Abrahamic/Judeo-Christian/Semitic or what ever the fuck you wanna call it. But i have no issue with moderate followers of these religions or any form of religion.(Excluding the Church of Satan. Atheists in Scary costumes isnt a religion its a pain in the ass) but anyone who is an extremist to their religion i find to be disgusting
as to stereotypes and what not, i do have a friend who is muslim. She's americanized as all hell and has some of the dirtiest sex stories ive ever been told, so i dont think she fits into the stereotype at all haha
Yeah, fuck LaVey Satanism!
I totally want to meet that muslim friend of yours...
i havent seen her in some time, she's a grade below me so i dont see her often haah
It's like some have sort of said, Christianity has been targeted in metal for so long there's absolutely no shock value anymore. Anti-christian lyrics are now like the safe route
However you target Islam or most any other religion, the shitstorm awaits.
Though Exodus did write Children of a Worthless God which is a total shot at Muslim extremists.
I've often found Exodus to be a band that goes after issues that other bands ignore, and that is part of why they are my favorite band.
"Christianity has been targeted in metal for so long there's absolutely no shock value anymore. Anti-christian lyrics are now like the safe route"
Your point here is categorically true, but only to a certain degree. I think it also has a lot to do as well, with where the band resides. A band say, oh making a black metal or anti christian death metal album in North America, will likely slip off the radar, or not garner much refutation or responses.The social demographic of areas like North America and even parts of Europe now, have become more broadened to different beliefs, ways of life and speaking against certain aspects of theism doesn't really promote any kind of "wow" factor.This is probably because it's become common place for many to speak out against the ways of the old.
However, if you are to record an album that has anti theosophical lyrics of any kind, especially against Catholicism/Christianity, in countries such as Costa Rica, or some parts of rural Finland or even Mexico, you are fundamentally going against the mass of the culture there and you would most likely face some criticism,this is because the fabric of those societies really haven't fully shifted away from a religious foundation, it's almost expected in the youths to either conform to the idea or at least not speak out against it.So, therefore a level of risk is indeed going to occur in those areas.In essence, it's not so much that the lyrics are pointless, no matter where the band comes from, but it's just that they can lose an edge....not necessarily a "safe route" but it's definitely flogging a dead horse so to speak.
I think through observation on videos and songs I would agree with you about this oncoming "shitstorm". For example, the few bands that have been brave enough so far to speak out against other religions and varieties of desert theism,including Islam and Sharia law, have at times faced vicious backlash including threats of rape, violence, murder...burning in "hell", etc....all quite pathetic and all quite serious.
Ah good point about the region factor
""However, if you are to record an album that has anti theosophical lyrics of any kind, especially against Catholicism/Christianity, in countries such as Costa Rica, or some parts of rural Finland or even Mexico, you are fundamentally going against the mass of the culture""
That´s right dude. Mexico population is a 90% catholic, so I guess the mexican black metal bands have anti-catholic lyrics because is the predominant religion. But maybe it´s time for song anti-islam songs around the globe.
It´s nice to see a lot of metalheads with a useful brain & not just long hair.
i just found an exodus shirt like this!:
http://www.corpseclothing.com/merchandise-exodus-mp-zombies-t-shirt.html
double post
As Tom Araya once said
Religion is hate
Religion is fear
Religion is war
Religion is rape
Religion's obscure
Religion's a whore
^so true^
too bad tom Araya is a god-fearing catholic lol
i dunno, but i personally feel catholicism is one of the worst variants of christianity due to its resistance to change and its strict emphasis on obedience to the hierarchy. a system imposed by man upon man, where one man profits from another's loss.
This goes for christians aswell as muslims: Keep your believes to yourself, don't try to conquer souls. That way i'm fine with it.
The thing which i'm absolutly NOT fine with is Sharia and the extremist orginisations like Sharia4Belgium and Sharia4Holland (in my region eh! :P), trying to get their religious bullshit to be THE law, fuck 'em!
YES!!! that is exactly the most outrageous and evil thing of all their stupid universalist goals (of the extremists i mean): they try to make their religious moral principles to be the law!! The epitome of intolerance and lack of respect for freedom.
I want to make it clear that i don't hate moderate Muslims, as many of you said, and in fact i met an Imam once, and he was very nice and open minded. My problem is with Islamic "law", and when extremism gets into the equation.
They are plenty of Muslims in my town, and they are unpleasant and rude people. And it pisses me off when they do shit than anyone else. and yeah Death to Islam and their dumb idoitic paths!
i almost forgot nazism is also related to islam
All types of organised religion should be wiped off the face of this earth once and for all. If that would happen (unfortunately not very likely), it would be the biggest achievement in the history of mankind.
Agreed...
I think it would be the best thing to have happened to this planet. Unfortunately though, I think mankind is stupid enough to find something else to argue about, and kill each other over. I don't have much "faith" in our kind...
Unfortunately I have to agree with you on that. Mankind is pretty much fucked.
I have nothing against god or people that worship a god but i really dont like religion. its the cause of all wars. if religion didn't exist then war wouldn't either and its stupid to kill each other for worshipping other gods then theirs. "Killing for religion..something I dont understand" - Megadeth
how did religion cause the War of 1812? Or the Spanish American War, Mexican-American War, Crimean War, French and Indian/7 Years War, Napoleonic Wars, Russian Civil War, American Civil War, Mexican Revolution, Vietnam War, Korean War, and the list goes on.... : p
saying that religion is the cause of all wars and that war wouldn't exist if religion didn't is a fairly pointless claim man
+1. most wars ( especially modern wars) have nothing to do with religion
I would say that although most wars in history have not been directly over religion, I think it definitely fuels some anger and hostility between groups, even though none admit to it.
I'm reminded of a Southpark episode where Cartman travels to the future where all religion has been eliminated but the world is at war between opposing factions of Atheists. It's a humorous show of course, but I believe the point is valid: Humanity will always disagree about something regardless of religion or lack thereof. It seems to be our nature to fight